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Count von Phoib

The Earth Is Flat!

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Wow, what rock has he been living under since his birth. Next thing he's claiming there is no such thing as gravity :-/

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The funniest thing is his final argument, his opponent is wrong because his science is not confirmed in the Koran. One might think he was having an internet argument.

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Wow, that whole time I felt really bad for the other guy trying to argue something so obviously proven when his opponent basically throws in Koran quotes. I mean wtf is he supposed to say to that. Christ if I were him I'd get the fuck off that show before I end up decapitated on some Al Quaeda training video. Religion... nuff' said.

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I love that he is basing his view on a verse that says "the breadth of paradise is as the breadth of the heavens and the earth".

Since that is an identity statement it could easily be taken to mean "they are both as round as each other" :lol:

 

I also feel sorry for anyone whose faith is going to be decided by facts about the natural world

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Of course that was fake. If that was a real conversation the universe would implode on itself and start from the beginning which would confirm the theory of the big bang, thus confirming that you could be your own father if you had a time machine.

 

:wacko: :blink: :wacko:

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Uhm... why would you think that was a fake?

 

If it is a fake it is an absolutely brilliant and genious fake. The guy arguing the side of science holds up a science book... why in the world would he hold up a science book if they were arguing about anything but something related to science. The religious guy makes hand gestures demonstrating his warped view of distance perspective. When he talks about the iris being split in half he also demonstrates it with his hands. I mean... if you think this is fake I wonder if you even watched the video. Not to mention that if somebody had faked this they would have to have a knowledge of the Koran that someone simply trying to make fun of Iraqis would be unlikely to have.

 

Sadly this is likely NOT a fake and is infact not that surprising. Devout religious people are fucked up... all over the world and especially in regions where extremism flourishes like say... Iraq. You don't have to blow yourself up to be an extremist. There are retard extremists all over the U.S. that believe things just as absolutely ridiculous like for example... Mike Huccabe (sp?).

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I met some Baptist girls a while back who didn't know what "evolution" referred to or who Darwin was.

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I met some Baptist girls a while back who didn't know what "evolution" referred to or who Darwin was.

 

I bet they didn't know what a cleveland steamer was either, did they? ;)

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I met some Baptist girls a while back who didn't know what "evolution" referred to or who Darwin was.

 

And don't forget the people who believe the world is only 5,000 years old! They were handing out their little booklets on campus again today, which is always good for a laugh.

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I met some Baptist girls a while back who didn't know what "evolution" referred to or who Darwin was.

 

And don't forget the people who believe the world is only 5,000 years old! They were handing out their little booklets on campus again today, which is always good for a laugh.

 

Being a man of science, i am not convinced that the earth is older than roughly 6000 years.

 

To be honest, every current method of dating has been proven accurate until 5000-6000 years ago.

Any method used to determine age beyond that period, has been calibrated with carbon dating which itself is only reliable up to 6000 years.

 

 

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If you consider the time it's taken for humans to spread over the earth and develop, there isn't enough time for the dinosaurs to have done that, then died, then humans do it too.

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Devout religious people are fucked up... all over the world and especially in regions where extremism flourishes like say... Iraq. You don't have to blow yourself up to be an extremist. There are retard extremists all over the U.S. that believe things just as absolutely ridiculous like for example... Mike Huccabe (sp?).

 

I guess you're the smartest guy around then?

 

Being devout and religious or spiritual does not make you an extremist. You're letting your hatred for religion cloud your judgement there, based on that shit I can just as easily say you're a retard too. And the next time you try to make a point, try to be intelligible and do some research on the people you're actually trying to hurt.

Edited by Godwin

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I met some Baptist girls a while back who didn't know what "evolution" referred to or who Darwin was.

 

And don't forget the people who believe the world is only 5,000 years old! They were handing out their little booklets on campus again today, which is always good for a laugh.

 

Being a man of science, i am not convinced that the earth is older than roughly 6000 years.

 

To be honest, every current method of dating has been proven accurate until 5000-6000 years ago.

Any method used to determine age beyond that period, has been calibrated with carbon dating which itself is only reliable up to 6000 years.

Does that age limitation carry on to the rest of the universe as well?

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I don't know.

I'm saying that there is no reliable method of age determination beyond 6000 years.

 

It is possible that the universe is older, but now can you determine the age without an accurate method.

Sadly enough all current methods for age determination further than 6000 years, have been calibrated using the carbon dating method. However the carbon dating method is only reliable up to 6000 years.

 

Because of this, it is simply not possible to make any age determinations beyond the 6000 year threshold.

This does not mean that it is impossible that the universe is older than 6000 years, but it cannot be proven at this time.

 

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Define reliable. I always found the idea behind radio-dating using Uranium-lead quite solid. You can calculate the half-life of Uranium out of that, and that's slightly larger then 6000 years.

 

(Note to the "OMG YOU PHAIL" crowd, Andre27 does have a bachelor in chemistry and could most probably whoop all of our asses in a chemistry quiz)

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On a quick reference for those not familiar: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uranium-lead_dating

 

Though i have to agree that the idea behind this method is certainly interesting, it's the details and practical uses which worry me.

 

Taken from this wiki:

 

Uranium-lead dating is usually performed on the mineral zircon (ZrSiO4), though it can be used on other minerals such as monazite, titanite, and baddeleyite. Zircon incorporates uranium and thorium atoms into its crystalline structure, but strongly rejects lead. Therefore we can assume that the entire lead content of the zircon is radiogenic. Where this is not the case, a correction must be applied.

 

Not all dated materials contain this mineral and the "correction" is not explained thoroughly.

There is also the assumption that the rate of decay is constant while obvious external factors as heat and radiation are ignored.

 

Some background on Zircon: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zircon

 

As one can see, this mineral is either found in the earth's crust or in asteroids/meteors. Both are locations which have been exposed to extreme heat, which could speed up decay, which in turn makes this unreliable as a method for the determination of age.

 

Anyway, going to call this discussion a quits for now (head spinning due to the flue.. glad there's a spell check).

 

Edit:

 

I stopped paying attention after "Being a man of science" :V

 

Isn't ignorance a wonderful thing when it suits your purpose.

Edited by Andre27

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Sure, radio carbon dating is only extremely accurate back as far as the Methuselah tree lets us verify, but if the tree itself is almost 5,000 years old, I'd assume it took a little longer than that to create a suitable California for it to grow in. And, if it's accurate back that far, chances are the Earth didn't have a miraculous and major shift in the amount of Carbon 14 in the atmosphere that would give us readings hundreds of millions of years off the mark. Carbon dating is, so far as we can tell right now, only off by between 3 and 10%. Just because the system isn't perfectly accurate doesn't mean it can't give us a ballpark figure. Throwing it out entirely is like saying the thermometer is useless because it can't measure up to 5,000º when we only need it to measure the water temperature in the pool. Furthermore, carbon dating isn't the only way to date the age of things - in fact, last I checked, it was only a way of dating once-living matter. The Earth is made of a heck of a lot more than just once-living things, and much older things as well.

 

Indeed, the age of the Earth was not dated by carbon dating at all; it was dated by measuring decay rates of the oldest igneous rocks we could find (meaning these were formed in the Earth and didn't just fall onto it) and then by meteorites because, as it turns out, asteroids are just "leftovers" from planetary formation and are, therefore similar in age to the planets. The study of these rocks in the determination of the Earth's age back in 1953 actually lead to the creation of the first sterile laboratory because back in those days, atmospheric lead from leaded gasoline had been contaminating the samples. At any rate, enough samples were gathered for testing at the Argonne Natl. Lab in Illinois and, judging from them, the age of the Earth is roughly 4.550 billion years old, give or take 70 million years. Sure, decay rates can speed up with heat or be slowed down by pressure, but we're not talking about stuff that could throw us 99.9% off the mark.

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I don't know.

I'm saying that there is no reliable method of age determination beyond 6000 years.

 

It is possible that the universe is older, but now can you determine the age without an accurate method.

Sadly enough all current methods for age determination further than 6000 years, have been calibrated using the carbon dating method. However the carbon dating method is only reliable up to 6000 years.

 

Because of this, it is simply not possible to make any age determinations beyond the 6000 year threshold.

This does not mean that it is impossible that the universe is older than 6000 years, but it cannot be proven at this time.

 

There other methods of determining the age of the universe besides carbon dating and such. For example, we know the speed of light and we can confirm the distance between our planet and distant stars by using what we know about universal gravitation and the measurements of the movements of stellar object which were carried out by spacecraft. Thus, if light from stars more distant than 6000 light years away has reached out planet the universe must be older than 6000 years.

 

 

But basically, there really isnt a way to be 100% certain because as religious people might say, God could have simply created the universe 6000 years ago to appear this way, but you have to weigh all the evidence even if it is not absolute proof and form the conclusion with the highest probability of being accurate.

 

 

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